I know that 1st year associates in Atlanta start at $115, but can anyone tell me the pay scale for 2nd-8th year associates?

what does "partner track" associate mean?

I think "partner track" is a euphemism for "not laid off" or some such thing. Or maybe it's just happythink: all our associates are on the *partner track*!

"Or maybe it's just happythink: all our associates are on the *partner track*!"

this is the correct response.

Question for those who know: Do associates in different branch offices often work together? And are there strange dynamics when, for example, a more senior associate is giving orders to a more junior associate, who nonetheless makes more money than the senior?

Yeah, but $115K/year is a lot more purchasing power in ATL than $160K/year in NYC.

I worked in a K&S branch office that was market for several years. Loved it but left for geographical reasons. I know NYC has been paid market for the last few years, but haven't sniffed the bonuses that other firms do until maybe very recently.

Honestly though, I think the Atlanta lawyers at K&S have to be some of the most underpaid in the country. Atlanta is getting to be not cheap (more expensive than Texas, at least) and I can tell you from experience that they do some very sophisticated work across all departments. The K&S client and deal list rivals about anyone.

As for the "dynamic," I never noticed any resentment among associates. I know the partnership is VERY bottom line with respect to PPP.

To: Anon 8:10 PM
cc: Compensation and Policy Committees of "Local Market" firms
There is tension among those of us in lower paid offices when we work with associates in higher paid offices. They mock us (it's sort of friendly, but stings nonetheless). It bothers many of us that our lower salaries subsidize the higher salaries and bonuses of our so-called peers. Morale suffers and we get the excuse from the partners that they follow a "local" approach to setting comp. Especially irksome is the fact that I might be assigning work to a junior associate in NY or some other higher paid office who gets paid more than I. It doesn't create feelings of inferiority because we all know that's not WHY the junior is paid more, but it's still demoralizing. Why should someone with less experience and knowledge get paid more than I when we are working for the same clients on the same matters, and the junior is charged out at a lower billing rate? I get paid less than them, yet I have to fix their mistakes?

The ATL attorneys who cause the real tension are the IP attorneys who have passed the patent bar. They get paid on a different pay scale which is about the same as the base biglaw DC rates. However, if an attorney works in the IP group who has not passed the patent bar, they get paid the regular ATL rate, even though they are doing the same work as the IP attorneys who have passed the patent bar (at least on the IP litigation side).

As a mid-level associate, I like my job and find the work interesting, but with each passing year, the emphasis on high quality work shrinks, and the office politics grow stranger as partners who have failed to grow the pie spend enormous effort finding reasons to keep associates out of the partnership and non-equity partners from advancing. Non-equity partners in ATL are never moving up, and yet they keep billing thousands of hours year after year. It's the non-equity partners who get worked up about NYC associate salaries. How do you think they like making less than associates and having no chance to advance? There are some bitter non-equity partners in this office.

Any chance K&S will lead a move in Atown? Seems to me the entire ATL market has a big problem on their hands.

No chance. ATL just got a raise a little over a year ago.

Atl moved to $115K last year and Texas blew by them to $140 less than a month later.

Atlanta is a regional market leader and doesn't have to worry about a lot of NY and DC firms in the Southeast markets (Charlotte, Atlanta, Birmingham) stealing talent away. Lots of people want to end up in the South and K&S and A&B know this and don't have incentive to keep up with the other market.

The thing is, they get talent, and until people stop coming to Atlanta, the big boys there don't really have to pay attention to all of this.

K&S to me doesn't seem like a firm that likes to charge ahead in anything. Just look at how they have opened maybe one office in the last five years when "comparable" firms have opened five.

Ummm, Dubai?

Yep -- just opened Dubai. The K&S Houston office is also an unmitigated success after a little hiccup several years ago. I will say that their Houston crew drove the opening of both the London and Dubai offices.

Atlanta will always lag until the dozens of UVA, UNC, Duke, Georgetown and Harvard students that simply want to be in Atlanta every year, money be damned, start to dry up.

How is the quality of life at the Atlanta Office? Does it feel like working in a big NYC firm in terms of hours/workload/atmosphere? The warm weather seems nice, but if you never make it outside...

"Does it feel like working in a big NYC firm in terms of hours/workload/atmosphere?"

Yes, in many practice groups.

K&S reaps a huge windfall from "the dozens of UVA, UNC, Duke, Georgetown and Harvard students that simply want to be in Atlanta" but also want to do interesting, national work. Every other ATL firm is more or less a regional firm, so the prestige factor is enough to keep drawing these kids to K&S. If other ATL firms raise, K&S will match, but K&S has NO incentive to be a salary leader.

Whoever said Atlanta 8th years get paid less than NYC 1st years at K&S doesn't know what they are talking about.

The scale in Atlanta is:

1st - 115
2nd - 120
3rd - 125
4th - 132
5th - 142
6th - 155
7th - 165
8th - 170

8th year, 6th year, the point is still pretty clear. You have senior associates making less than 1st and 2nd years now.

Look at K&S PPP. They can afford to bump Atlanta. They just don't have to.

8th year, 6th year, the point is still pretty clear. You have senior associates making less than 1st and 2nd years now.

Look at K&S PPP. They can afford to bump Atlanta. They just don't have to.

thanks for posting the salary scale. with the bonuses paid in NYC, it seems that a 1st year's total compensation would still be greater than an 8th year's total comp in Atlanta?

What are bonuses like in Atlanta?

thanks for posting the salary scale. with the bonuses paid in NYC, it seems that a 1st year's total compensation would still be greater than an 8th year's total comp in Atlanta?

What are bonuses like in Atlanta?

Out of curiousity, what are the hours like for a mid-level associate in the litigation departments of these big NYC firms? For example, are people able to maintain a somewhat constant 12 hour workday with occasional weekends, or is it worse than that? Are there differences between firms? If so, which litigation departments are best?

Out of curiousity, what are the hours like for a mid-level associate in the litigation departments of these big NYC firms? For example, are people able to maintain a somewhat constant 12 hour workday with occasional weekends, or is it worse than that? Are there differences between firms? If so, which litigation departments are best?

As found at http://cgi.money.cnn.com/tools/costofliving/costofliving.html

Salary in New York (Manhattan) NY: $160,000
Comparable salary in Atlanta GA: $74,137.78

If you move from New York (Manhattan) NY to Atlanta GA...

Groceries will cost: 29.126% less
Housing will cost: 75.804% less
Utilities will cost: 39.952% less
Transportation will cost: 11.085% less
Healthcare will cost: 23.669% less

Looks like Atlanta is overpaid even after the hike... but I bet that doesn't make that Atlanta K&S 4th year in business formal doing 7-11 feel any better.

Nope. Sure doesn't. And the best part is that we found out about this here and not through the firm. Talk about showing the love,

1:21 --

Agree generally on the cost of living disparity, but remember that student debt in Atlanta = student debt in Manhattan.

No one has answered the question about bonuses in Atlanta. What do they range?

My transportation expenses in NYC are $76 a month for an unlimited Metro card, and generously let's say another $76 a month in taxis (I take a town car home from the office at night / weekends if I have to work, so we're talking just the occasional taxi). Pardon me if I'm a little suspicious that my transportation costs would be 11% less than that... We used to live in a southern state and our transportation costs were $1000 a month (car payments, insurance and gas). The only thing in NYC that is significantly more expensive than elsewhere is housing. But if you figure that what you don't spend on a car you can spend on housing, the cost of living argument loses a lot of its appeal IMHO.

My transportation expenses in NYC are $76 a month for an unlimited Metro card, and generously let's say another $76 a month in taxis (I take a town car home from the office at night / weekends if I have to work, so we're talking just the occasional taxi). Pardon me if I'm a little suspicious that my transportation costs would be 11% less than that... We used to live in a southern state and our transportation costs were $1000 a month (car payments, insurance and gas). The only thing in NYC that is significantly more expensive than elsewhere is housing. But if you figure that what you don't spend on a car you can spend on housing, the cost of living argument loses a lot of its appeal IMHO.

Actually the comparison is better if you do it the other way. Not sure student loan debt is much of an equalizer there really.

Salary in Atlanta GA: $115,000
Comparable salary in New York (Manhattan) NY: $248,186.54

You guys - seriously. Isn't there ANYTHING you all like about your jobs besides money? We all get paid a lot. A lot. If you guys are so bent out of shape about a $15k difference that you would LEAVE your office...you should probably just leave anyway. Find something you actually like doing. And think for a second about how much freaking money we all make. I am reading this board hoping that in a couple years I do not start to sound like most of the people on here. But you know, it's a lot of law STUDENTS too. When I was a law student (very recently)I was so excited to have a job at a prestigious law firm - you guys sound so entitled. Who gave you that ridiculous sense of entitlement? Ugh.

RE: bonuses in atl, most firms do not do the NYC or DC-style "big" bonus. I know A&B just gives a 5K bonus to all classes if you bill over appx. 2K. The same goes for other southern markets-- charlotte and raleigh etc. Most of those firms really don't do bonuses at all, so total compensation ends up being much less. Of course, I wouldn't trade the quality of life differences for anything.

There was a comment on another board that Troutman raised $15K in NY for each class and $10K for each class in its other cities (including Atlanta).

It's odd that there's been nothing from A&B.

Salary talk misses the point - K&S NY is in meltdown mode and the increase is a sign of desperation following years of denial. After lagging the market for years, management is finally trying to stop the bleeding now that all the profitable practices have departed for greener pastures. Only question now is how long IP lasts...