Fall Recruiting Crazy Rumor Watch: Skadden and Minority Students
As we mentioned before, we regularly receive all sorts of apocryphal rumors related to the fall recruiting process.
The gossip can be salacious and fun to read -- even if turns out to be untrue. Like this rumor, which we heard from a University of Virginia law student quite some time ago:
Skadden has not interviewed here on grounds yet.... [Ed. note: We believe that they have by now.]There are some rumors going around the school that a handful of my classmates, all of whom are minorities, have already received offers from Skadden. Obviously, any rumor must be taken with a grain of salt, but the word here is that offers were made very early to minority candidates in an effort to attract more minorities. I know of at least two with offers and both are African-American. Neither worked for Skadden last summer, which is the red flag in my eyes....
As I said, I'm not too familiar with the NALP rules, but others have indicated to me that those early offers are not proper given the NALP rules and regulations. I personally could not care -- I'm not interested in Skadden or the markets in which Skadden is interviewing for at UVa -- but I read the site regularly and wanted to pass along the information.
Sadly, it appears that this gossip -- while juicy and potentially controversial -- is not true.
The explanation appears after the jump.
We checked with sources at Skadden. Here is what they told us:
1. Students interested in working at Skadden may contact the firm before on-campus interviews.
2. There is nothing in the NALP rules that forbids such contact.
3. This year, as in past years, a number of UVA students reached out to the firm before Skadden came to Charlottesville.
4. As a result of such contacts, a number of UVA students received offers from Skadden, even before the firm showed up on campus.
5. Some of the recipients of offers were minorities. But the majority actually were not.
This makes sense to us. But if we're missing part of the story, please let us know, by email. Thanks.
Earlier: Fall Recruiting Crazy Rumor Watch: Let Tier Two Grads Eat Tastykake
(61) Comments
OMG people getting offers!!!....someone call the NALP police!
this guy is destined for greatness.
Leave Skadden alone you bitter UVA dick
SECOND. Did they offer the Jena 6?
Jena to 190!
What's the point of OCI if you can just reach out to Skadden or other firms before they come on campus? And why doesn't everyone do this?
(I guess, though, the net result is that more UVA students get an interview -- those that do the OCIs and those that "reach out" beforehand. Still, if Skadden has already extended offers, the UVA students who have patiently waited for their OCI may find themselves competing for fewer slots. Guess I just don't like "gaming the system," by allowing everyone to go outside/interview on their own schedule, even if perfectly legal under NALP rules. Do other schools/firms do this? At my T14 school, it was only suggested that you send firms you were super interested in your resume if you didn't receive an OCI through the on campus bidding process.)
More "diversity" bs
WHOOSH!
The truth just went right over your head didn't it 3:49?
People contact firms before OGIs (OCIs are for suckers, we say OGIs - On Grounds Interview) all the time.
First, people are already in New York for their 1L summer will send their resume and try to knock out the interview then.
Second, Skadden did not interview at Virginia until today and I'm sure some students probably did not want to wait that long which is understandable.
Finally, I bet some of these kids know an associate or parter at Skadden and they dropped the kid's resume which led to a callback.
Why pass along gossip that turns out not to be true?
because that's what gossiping is all about, in case you didn't know
As a former V5 summer this past summer I know of at least three incoming summers who basically had a callback before their respective OCIs thanks to having resumes passed along by the then current summers... so this isn't all that out of the ordinary
This was newsworthy???
I'm going to interpret 3:47(1) as sarcasm.
Nice one!
Why post this Lat when it only serves to bring out the Minorities are taking over" crazies? The "tipster" sounds like someone who didn't get a bid for OCI and is just bitter.
Isnt't the Dewey/LeBoeuf merger approval bigger news than this?
1) There were an outlandish # of these kids at UVA and all linked to Skadden not any other firms
2) All of them that I am aware of (5) are minorities
3) Skadden also came down weeks in advance of its OGI and held a barbeque and out to bars night without mentioning it to Career Services. They put the word out through last years summers and the kids they had alreay made offers to.
4) I could care less as Im a 3L with an offer but it does seem to be a big FU to UVAs system concept if Skadden feels it can do an end around whenever it finds the rules inconvient to it
There are minorities at UVa?
im pretty sure that UVA wouldn't care by what means their grads get hired by Skadden, inside or outside of their system it makes them look good.
that said, no matter when you sign with them.. you'll still be a "Skadden Douchebag"
Everyone keeps mentioning GULC, GW, GMU, AU and Catholic. But what about William and Mary? How does William and Mary do in terms of OCI and recruiting and placement at biglaw DC and biglaw NY? Do you have to be in the top 25% + journal to even get an on campus interview for biglaw DC? Is biglaw NY even harder? How many biglaw firms even recruit on W&M campus?
When I was at UVA, the rumor was that the key to the Skadden offer was simply impressing them at the happy hour before the interview. Some of the shadiest characters got callbacks that way. I don't know personally - I didn't try to interview with them.
Of course, all the UVA people that I know that are still there now are quality people. So maybe those duds never made it to SA status.
This practice does seem to screw over the associates actually waiting for OGI - there have to be fewer slots available for them.
This is pretty commonplace. I am a white male and had an interview/offer from another top firm weeks before my school's OCI.
When I visited UVA when deciding where to go (last spring), it felt like there wasn't even a handful of minorities in the entire law school.
minority job fairs often occur weeks before oci.
most of the minorities with decent grades at my school had offers well before OCI started.
minority schminority...
Shame on Lat for trying to stir up trouble.
I like how 3:49 PM considered doing everything within the rules to get a job "gaming the system". No wonder they are at a cruddy law school.
Pre-OCI offers/etc. are very commonplace in the IP area too. Loyola Patent Fair (no way associated with L2L) is a national IP law job fair held in Chicago in early August, and lots of IP people get their offers then. So I guess you have two options: become a minority and take advantage of the minority job fairs, or go get a B.S.
Stirring up trouble is part of Lat's job description.
Why is it always southerners that stir up racial issues? Redneck!
Did OGI....had two offers before my school OCI even started posting interview schedule
Did OGI....had two offers two weeks before my school OCI even started.
Are Asians considered minorities anymore? Do Asians (especially females) from W&M law get this kind of privilege from biglaw DC or biglaw NY?
Skadden sucks
UVA is such a douchebag factory. Who complains about something like this?!
FYI-- the alleged rumors are not widespread at UVA. I interviewed with Skadden this morning, as did several of my friends, and none of us knew anything about this until we saw it on ATL. I really think this story is making something out of nothing.
So... some people put in extra effort beyond and in advance of OCI.. and someone thinks this is "unfair"? It in no way screws over those who waited for OCI. It's called doing what you gotta do to get a job.
Just can't wait to see these complainers get to a firm and freak out when... OMG -- the other side moves for summary judgment!!! How dare they?!
What is all this nonsense about OCI? Skadden sent me an offer letter they day after I got admitted to my fancy Tier1 school. I'm not sure what the fuss is about.
although this particular rumor may not be true, i've noticed some serious reverse discrimination by firm recruiters. every minority student i know has had numerous callbacks and multiple offers, despite some of them having truly awful grades. as a white male, all i'd like is to be judged by the content of my character and transcript rather than the color of my skin.
Quick question--does geography count as diversity? Like would a NY firm like a kid from California, or is that just silly? Please advise.
7:14--is fibbing!!! I bet you don't know any minorities much less know how many offers they got.
6:09, the only privilege you're going to get is WGWAG. Seriously.
You keep asking about W&M. Just go somewhere better.
My point was why should UVA put in place rules if the firms and the students have no intention of following them? If everyone can just interview with biglaw firms before they get to OCIs (or OGIs), why isn't everyone doing so? And if everyone is doing so, why have the rules in the first place?
And no, L.T.E.S., I'm obviously not going to get upset when opposing counsel files a motion for summary judgment. But if s/he fails to do so in a timely manner, I'll object. Same deal here: UVA needs to tell its students what the real procedure is,* and not let those who believe they are following the rules get screwed over when most of the slots are taken by people who interviewed on their own months ago. While it may be perfectly kosher under NALP's system, UVA is big on its honor code, and setting forth rules that only some people follow seems to contradict that spirit.
*My concerns don't apply to students who were recruited through minority job fairs or via a personal connection with a partner as those 'outside the system' connections are par for the course, relatively rare, and expected/adjusted for under the current system. Here, however, it seems like a large number of UVA students unconnected to a firm are nonetheless applying outside of the OCI/OGI system. If that's the case, shouldn't all UVA students do this? Aren't the ones sitting around and waiting for OCIs/OGIs at a disadvantage applying to fewer spots?
People probably contacted
9:14, get a life, son. That's the longest post I've ever seen.
Quit your bitching. You've got tons of opportunities at UVA. I'm a 3L there, so I know firsthand. Big fucking deal if you can't get a job at Skadden. Life goes on.
Wait a minute... isn't hiring minorities supposed to be a GOOD thing? Don't big companies (including firms) spend millions of dollars every year trying to make their employee pool "representative" of the population as a whole?
I guess I don't see the issue here...
Why don't you put the truth "before the jump"? Makes for better journalism from what I hear.
Skadden was put into the second round of interviews (not early interview week), so they gave out some early callbacks because they were afraid of not getting U.Va. students.
For whatever reason, some people at U.Va. really like Skadden.
NYC to 190!
10:08 - ATL is a gossip blog, not journalism. That's why it leads with the salacious rumor, and provides the truth as an afterthought.
this is 100% true. if you have a pulse, go to a "real" school (maybe including l2l), and are a minority - you will get an offer at skadden. they want women too. luckily the attrition is so high that they can keep this train running for a long time!
UVA is a TTT
Idiots: Lat "posts," we "comment." Let's get that straight.
Thanks.
Does anyone know how much of a tax break a law firm (or corporation) gets for employing minorities?
I know the the tax savings are a large factor in hiring minorities at corporations and course law firms.
Ha Ha Ha, snobby elitist law students getting frozen out of jobs by people who were a little more aggressive than they were.
And BTW in the real world, only pricks with poor cases object to Motions not being filed in a timely manner.
Big deal. Skadden is an equal opportunity slave driver once you get in, anyhow.
Not cool Richie, not cool.
I am a white male who currently works at a top 20 law firm. This debate comes up so often by the embittered white male law student who couldn't get a job. I think its funny...I had a middle of the road GPA and still did extremely well during OCI over my peers with much higher grades. Supply and demand, its really simple. I went to a top 10 law school and there were no more than 8 - 15 african americans in the entire school of nearly 1200 law students. Of course they are going to be a hot commodity to big firms because there are no minorities at top law schools. Secondly, have you ever looked at Skadden's summer class? Of the 100 some odd S.A.'s they bring in every year, only about 2-4 are african american. What happened to the other 96 whites? Could it be that you failed to get an offer because were socially inept, extremely weird or simply a douche bag and the partner saw through your horrid interview? Grades and associate performance don't have much correlation. If you come from a top law school 90% of the time you are smart enough and qualified enough for the job regardless of race or grades. As a matter of fact the only people I have known not to receive an offer from at the end of the summer were white males. Please stop bitching about the "minority" taking spots in a pathetic attempt to project your failures onto other people. You need to accept the fact that whoever you interviewed with didn't think you were more qualified than the other white candidates who did receive offers. Advantages come in all forms and shapes. I know plenty of white males who had the advantage of having a friend at the firm speak to someone on their behalf to get a better opportunity of receiving a call back or offer.
Nice, 4:23.
there are a few minority students who either summered at skadden this past summer or just started there full-time this year. b/c of that connection, they have helped to fund minority organization events in the past. my guess is that those who got offers either 1) interviewed during a minority career fair or 2) had their resume passed along by one of the minorities who already worked there or 3) just got in touch with them before ogi. i know of a number of people who got jobs in one of these ways. i guess my question is, (assuming that this person "reporting" this rumor isn't just a racist) why didn't he/she just ask them...we won't bite. lol!
meaning minorities at uva won't bite. i am definitely not one of the skadden people...
typical - the partnership ranks are full of white males and whenever any minority actual does well, people just presume its cos of their skin color - I wonder the the person who wrote it ever thought that it might be cos those particular minority student actually kicked ass in law school or interview really well?
if Skadden recruits the same way it did six years ago when i graduated from UVA, they will take anyone and everyone from UVA who will accept an offer. They did the same thing that year, came down before OGI interviews, took a bunch of us out for dinner and drinks, and gave us all call back offers that night. Literally, without seeing my resume. Two years later the firm was classy enough to bring down a partner who employed the same tactic and then hooked up with a 2L (and stayed in his house, with his six other roomates mind you).
I agree with the earlier comment, some of the sketchiest people i went to law school with summered there. But there were also some very bright people who thought it was right environment for them. But it was this experience alone that shaped my impression of Skadden and why I think it is laughable that it is deemed as prestigious or as competitive, at least in the recruiting process, as the other top NYC firms.
My take is I don't think it is a minority thing. I just think Skadden is desperate to fill their ranks. Good news for the other top firms in NYC, mine included, we get plenty of UVA students without having to look so pathetic.
See, this is why I turned down TTT UVa. Talk about stupid students. Student (read: white) sees minority get offer, and of course, it can't be b/c of merit or anything like that. Why, it has to be AA! Let's git 'em!
Stupid.